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Your mind focuses on one thing. Do you know what I mean? Yes, ma’am. Do you think that if Gypsy hadn’t asked you to kill her mom, you’d have ever killed her mom? I know I wouldn’t have done it. Okay. You just did it because you loved Gypsy and Gypsy asked you to do it. Is that what I’m thinking? Yes. Okay. For him to ruin his life over that, I’m sorry, but she’s a beast. Yeah. She now doesn’t have a language beyond manipulation and retaliation. I mean, is she taking any sort of– you know, is she like, “Well, okay, it was me, too,” or is she to trying to put it all on Nick? She Radio takes some responsibility, but not much. Not much at all. Did you kill your mom? No. No, sir. Did you help? No, sir. No one else killed your mom? No, sir. No, sir. Did you have knowledge that Nicholas was going to kill your mom before he did it? No, sir. Okay. Sit tight for me, okay? It’s okay. I wonder if people feel that Gypsy is telling them the truth now. Female voice: Hello, you have a call from Radio Gypsy: Gypsy Rose. She was still in Wisconsin when she called me. Kristy on phone: Hey, my sweetie. Gypsy: Hi! Is this Kristy? Kristy: Yes, baby. Gypsy: Hi! Oh, my God. It’s so good to hear your voice. At that time, she still wasn’t trusting, really, anyone. She was still not telling Mike everything. Gypsy: I’m innocent. It’s a complicated situation, but what they say on the news is not true. Then we went in the courtroom, and that’s when they showed all the text messaging. And when they said they were presenting that, she turned around and looked at us with fear in her eyes. I guess she didn’t think that they were going to pull all of those messages up. Carr: Yeah, I did. They didn’t get caught red-handed, but they got caught red-handed. You know, they have a lot of evidence. They have the murder weapon, texts, videos. I mean, no doubt they did it or planned it and everything, so it was just a matter of why they did it, you know, and is that reasonable? Carr: Are you happy that your mom is not here to abuse you anymore? Yeah. But at the same time, I’m not happy that she’s dead. You know, I didn’t want that. I know it sounds strange to plan something and go through the steps to make it happen, and then– but at the same time not want it to happen. One of the problems with the legal system is that it demands that people have this one intention and this one moment in time and be certain about it, and I’m not sure that that really happens. And especially in this case, I’m not sure that it happens. It’s possible that Gypsy had ultimately ambivalent feelings about killing her mother. I wonder what she was thinking in the other room listening to her mother screaming sometimes. I didn’t think anything. I was scared. I was shaking. I just– I didn’t have a thought in my brain. It was like it was all not real. I was on a bunch of medications, and I know that’s no excuse, but on Xanax, I felt like I had no emotion and I wasn’t thinking right. Munchausen by proxy victims can lose contact with reality at times, and that may be part of the defence in Gypsy’s case. She may have trouble distinguishing what’s real and what isn’t. Is sickness real or is it fake? Is death real, or is it exaggerated or fake? So, I think she had limited capacity for reality testing, which just means seeing what’s normal behavior and what’s really strange behavior. Stanfield: Gypsy grew up in essentially an alternate reality to what the rest of us live. By her mother isolating her from the outside world, she doesn’t know or understand what normal really is. Hi. Gypsy: In so many ways, I don’t know what’s right, what’s wrong, but to say that, yes, I did this. I’m sorry for it. I feel bad for it. It just feels good to be honest. Gypsy: The only thing that I could’ve done differently that I know better now is reach out to my dad, told my dad. And he could have came and got me, and I would’ve went and lived with him. Rod: There’s a McDonald’s right here where I’d visit with Gypsy. At that time, she was real young. I remember one visit Radio she was so scared of me, man. She was shaking. I don’t know what Dee Dee told her about me, but I probably was the big bad wolf or something, you know? Gypsy must have been so confused, you know? She was probably telling her the day before that, you know, I don’t love her and all this stuff, and then here she is visiting with me and telling her, “Look, that’s your daddy. Give him a hug,” you know? That’s old history now, so we’re just going to try to build a real father-daughter intimate relationship, you know, like we should have. It’s hard. Thinking what she had to go through and that she didn’t have to go through all that. Woman: See this? Look at that. She would probably have been a perfectly fine kid had it not been her mom was Dee Dee. Okay, y’all want to get the table ready or what? Women: Yes. We’re going to eat off the trays? Claude: She could’ve had a normal life. I hope she gets out, and I don’t know what– what she’s going to do when she gets out. She was punished enough to where they should let her go free. That’s the way I feel.

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